Shirley quite conceivably didn't hear Alfie killing Sophie; she may have been asleep if, as forensic expert Bridget Chappuis maintains, the killing took place shortly after dawn. Also, the reluctance of the local gardai to look at Alfie as a serious suspect may have had less to do with his cannabis growing business than his popularity in the community; he was a benefactor of local sports clubs and charities, a great source of local information for the guards (and indeed his perfect patsy Ian Bailey), and an all-round likeable guy. I believe unconscious bias was to blame for their reluctance to suspect Alfie - and their kneejerk assumption that Ian Bailey was the killer. Anyone familiar with rural Ireland and cliquish communities will know exactly what I mean: the outsider is the default suspect. People believe what they want to believe.
Thanks for the comment. This explanation does fit. I added that final quote slightly later which does agree with you, i.e. Alfie was restless in the night and did leave the bedroom, just as Ian did.
Here's that French TV documentary I mentioned - it includes possibly the only interview with Shirley. I can't recall where I initially saw this, but it surfaces occasionally on YouTube and Reddit. Shirley appears at 2.25.
I'm really grateful for this, thanks. It's nice to put a face and a voice to the name of Shirley Foster. I wonder how many more people have blended into the background just because they were unwilling to appear in the more recent documentaries. It's also interesting to see a French perspective on the case. This week I got the ASSOPH booklet on Kindle and am practicing my French by working through that.
Everything that makes us doubt Alfie Lyons’s involvement applies pretty much to Ian Bailey also, other than Alfie’s reported physical incapacity. Also Ian Bailey had a lot further to travel to get there. The fact that Lyons knew Sophie, he was there that night and had had disputes with Sophie puts him points ahead of Bailey. Bailey’s history of violence points back to him and away from Lyons. The issue with Shirley Foster is the same as with Jules Thomas. The gate where Sophie’s body was found had been a bone of contention between Sophie and Alfie. Sophie wanted it always closed but usually it was left open unless Sophie was there. As she was only there a couple of times a year, it may have been hard for Alfie and Shirley to know and remember to close the gate. Sophie’s family have said she was quite confrontational so it’s possible there was an argument over the gate. I go round in circles thinking about this case - it’s such a conundrum. Having said this, I don’t think it was Lyons or Bailey - I would still be looking towards Sophie’s life at home for clues, or put it down as a random stranger - perhaps someone squatting in the vacant holiday house and being busted by Sophie. Seems like the cold case review might still be focusing on Bailey though and they say a result is still months away.
Thanks for commenting again, and happy Christmas! This case pulls me back in quite easily. There is so much to look into and reflect on. I often wish I could just accept that it was Ian, and sometimes I feel silly for not just accepting that, as so many people have. He seems to have put 95% of the locals against him, including the police. I keep coming back to the random stranger thought too, but it's just so unsatisfying. That would be a very simple explanation for a very impromptu crime scene. The lack of forensic help just adds to the frustration. Will we ever really know?
I don't believe forensics will find the killer if it was Alfie; he was all over the place that morning. He even touched Sophie' door... He also went back out to "warn" her that a murderer was on the loose - instead of phoning her from the safety of his cottage. The circumstantial evidence points strongly towards Alfie and no one else.
It is unfortunate that neither Alfie nor Shirley gave interviews (and Ian Bailey gave so many).
Questions I would like to see answered are:
1. When Shirley found the body why didn't she lock the car doors (there was likely a killer close by) do a U-turn and go back to the house to make sure Alfie was OK. Even opening the car door, not mind running up a hill and by a house where a killer might be hiding, sounds implausible but I have never discovered a body.
2. How was she comfortable with her (reportedly) feeble husband heading out to check on Sophie (a women he had numerous run ins with) leaving her alone in the house with a murderer on the loose. . As others have said, locking the doors and phoning would have made much more sense.
Actually the fact that they are going to test the clothes gives me hope that they will finally solve this. I didn't realise they still had her clothes.
Here's an example of the Irish media jumping to conclusions again...
The attached piece is written by one of the journalists who is convinced Ian Bailey was the killer.
Contrary to the narrative presented as fact in this piece, there is no evidence that the breeze block was used as a weapon. It might of course provide useful DNA as it was placed on Sophie's dressing gown, so it would have been touched with fingers / gloves (or something the killer used to cover his hands - a plastic bag / a sweater etc...Presume that after the frenzied attack the killer suddenly sobered up as the placing of the block on the dressing gown suggests an attempt to "stage" the scene for someone to find). Sophie's clothes will almost certainly provide useful DNA as the killer would certainly have had prolonged physical contact with her in the savage murder.
Shirley quite conceivably didn't hear Alfie killing Sophie; she may have been asleep if, as forensic expert Bridget Chappuis maintains, the killing took place shortly after dawn. Also, the reluctance of the local gardai to look at Alfie as a serious suspect may have had less to do with his cannabis growing business than his popularity in the community; he was a benefactor of local sports clubs and charities, a great source of local information for the guards (and indeed his perfect patsy Ian Bailey), and an all-round likeable guy. I believe unconscious bias was to blame for their reluctance to suspect Alfie - and their kneejerk assumption that Ian Bailey was the killer. Anyone familiar with rural Ireland and cliquish communities will know exactly what I mean: the outsider is the default suspect. People believe what they want to believe.
Thanks for the comment. This explanation does fit. I added that final quote slightly later which does agree with you, i.e. Alfie was restless in the night and did leave the bedroom, just as Ian did.
Here's that French TV documentary I mentioned - it includes possibly the only interview with Shirley. I can't recall where I initially saw this, but it surfaces occasionally on YouTube and Reddit. Shirley appears at 2.25.
https://youtu.be/UxVfe-t_rc0?si=xEfojHiYmsUg3lxd
I'm really grateful for this, thanks. It's nice to put a face and a voice to the name of Shirley Foster. I wonder how many more people have blended into the background just because they were unwilling to appear in the more recent documentaries. It's also interesting to see a French perspective on the case. This week I got the ASSOPH booklet on Kindle and am practicing my French by working through that.
Everything that makes us doubt Alfie Lyons’s involvement applies pretty much to Ian Bailey also, other than Alfie’s reported physical incapacity. Also Ian Bailey had a lot further to travel to get there. The fact that Lyons knew Sophie, he was there that night and had had disputes with Sophie puts him points ahead of Bailey. Bailey’s history of violence points back to him and away from Lyons. The issue with Shirley Foster is the same as with Jules Thomas. The gate where Sophie’s body was found had been a bone of contention between Sophie and Alfie. Sophie wanted it always closed but usually it was left open unless Sophie was there. As she was only there a couple of times a year, it may have been hard for Alfie and Shirley to know and remember to close the gate. Sophie’s family have said she was quite confrontational so it’s possible there was an argument over the gate. I go round in circles thinking about this case - it’s such a conundrum. Having said this, I don’t think it was Lyons or Bailey - I would still be looking towards Sophie’s life at home for clues, or put it down as a random stranger - perhaps someone squatting in the vacant holiday house and being busted by Sophie. Seems like the cold case review might still be focusing on Bailey though and they say a result is still months away.
Thanks for commenting again, and happy Christmas! This case pulls me back in quite easily. There is so much to look into and reflect on. I often wish I could just accept that it was Ian, and sometimes I feel silly for not just accepting that, as so many people have. He seems to have put 95% of the locals against him, including the police. I keep coming back to the random stranger thought too, but it's just so unsatisfying. That would be a very simple explanation for a very impromptu crime scene. The lack of forensic help just adds to the frustration. Will we ever really know?
I don't believe forensics will find the killer if it was Alfie; he was all over the place that morning. He even touched Sophie' door... He also went back out to "warn" her that a murderer was on the loose - instead of phoning her from the safety of his cottage. The circumstantial evidence points strongly towards Alfie and no one else.
It is unfortunate that neither Alfie nor Shirley gave interviews (and Ian Bailey gave so many).
Questions I would like to see answered are:
1. When Shirley found the body why didn't she lock the car doors (there was likely a killer close by) do a U-turn and go back to the house to make sure Alfie was OK. Even opening the car door, not mind running up a hill and by a house where a killer might be hiding, sounds implausible but I have never discovered a body.
2. How was she comfortable with her (reportedly) feeble husband heading out to check on Sophie (a women he had numerous run ins with) leaving her alone in the house with a murderer on the loose. . As others have said, locking the doors and phoning would have made much more sense.
All I can say is that you make very good points. Take a look at some comments on other posts by another member Geraldine Comiskey.
Maybe it was Shirley ?
Please add more! Did the killer need to be strong? What was the weapon? What the motive? Some think Sophie was stabbed.
Actually the fact that they are going to test the clothes gives me hope that they will finally solve this. I didn't realise they still had her clothes.
Here's an example of the Irish media jumping to conclusions again...
The attached piece is written by one of the journalists who is convinced Ian Bailey was the killer.
Contrary to the narrative presented as fact in this piece, there is no evidence that the breeze block was used as a weapon. It might of course provide useful DNA as it was placed on Sophie's dressing gown, so it would have been touched with fingers / gloves (or something the killer used to cover his hands - a plastic bag / a sweater etc...Presume that after the frenzied attack the killer suddenly sobered up as the placing of the block on the dressing gown suggests an attempt to "stage" the scene for someone to find). Sophie's clothes will almost certainly provide useful DNA as the killer would certainly have had prolonged physical contact with her in the savage murder.
https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/clothes-worn-by-sophie-toscan-du-plantier-sent-to-fbi-for-new-analysis/a1848032106.html?hConversionEventId=AQEAAZQF2gAmdjYwMDAwMDE5NC01NDYxLWViZjAtOGRlMS1jZTBmOGM4MzdlMDnaACRjNmI2NTIyNS0xNjI3LTRkNzktMDAwMC0wMjFlZjNhMGJjYzTaACQ5N2M2YTRkYi1iNzg4LTQ4ZjctYmZlMS1iMmEzNjYyNjcxZGT2bMgS-XlmP3HuwIh_z9yNq13S2RFyMsnku2CgWwkR9w&utm_campaign=IN:Daily&utm_content=zone_name&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_source=independent&utm_term=0-0&utm_testfeature=playvideo-202501110758
Is it possible that Shirley could have murdered Sophie?